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ting73, Sunday, 20th of August 2006, 18:00 UTC (20:00 CEST)[edit]

See ting-wiki for more about tings.


We are meeting half an hour before a ting on irc, server freenode, channel #onebigsoup.


We use Gobby as a collaborative editor. Use v0.3.x only please - older (and newer) versions are incompatile and will likely ruin the ting.

TheSheep provides a gobby 0.3.x standalone server. Adress is ting.sheep.art.pl port 6522 (default). Check irc.freenode #onebigsoup when there are problems to log in.


teamspeak-server is not active for today's ting, sry

We use teamspeak for VoIP. You find the teamspeak login data on the gobby page ting73_talk or ask on gobby or in irc.freenode #onebigsoup. teamspeak port is 8767 (default). Use quick connect to enter the server adress and join in. Configure your teamspeak to push-to-talk, please.

Joining the ting using gobby only is surely welcome.

second life[edit]

We tried to meet on second-life along with the ting. Add your second life name to the participants list, if you have one, please.

We chose a hobo hangout for tinging in second life. secondlife://caletta/113/221/26 are the coordinates. Try to get there or tell us your name in second life (on irc or gobby) so we can teleport you.

topic proposals[edit]

  • tings are open. so come up with a topic - you will realize pretty soon if someone's interested in it
  • add topic, we're not against them

some recommendations for ting[edit]

Please save the ting every few minutes on your hard-disk. In case gobby crashes (it does so sometimes) or in case somebody deletes all text we likely have a version to retrieve the ting without loosing too much of it. So save.

In case gobby crashes you have to relog in using a different name a n d a different color. You can not relog in using your former name o r color.

Also open the tingn_document page, please. It is for life-summarizing the ting. Copy results or precious passages over to it. #ting for example, but it is not yet. Hack that, please.

today's tingers[edit]

(sign: name, location, second-life identity, personal web-site)

maybe participates, dunno yet[edit]

  • add

collab-editor contents copied in[edit]

Mattis though yesterday was already sunday and thus we started yesterday already ting73_talk



  • ma: Mattis Manzel, Venice/Italy,
  • sh: Radomir Dopieralski, Poznań/Poland

ma: I've been so bold to spam about today's ting on #Kubuntu. Sorry.

sh: any good results? anybody interested?

ma: nil, silence for a minute, that was all.

sh: We are organizing Poznań Linux Days in March, care to come and tell abot the wikis? We can't sponsor the travel, but we can sponsor your being here (food, room, beer, etc.). It's two days, probably a weekend.

ma: heck! I thought it's sunday. Embarrasing. March 07? Yes. I'd like to. (wondering, next March is 07 already, hell)

sh: I don't know the exact day yet. It will be around March 2007. We are wondering if we could ask Stallman to come ;).

ma: ask, I guess he likes that. Would be great. Saw him on wikimania. "Piracy is attacking ships"

sh: Yeah. But I'll wait a bit until the web page for the conference is up, I think. If he really came, we'd have to find much bigger lecture rooms :).

ma: Downloaded some stuff recently from and with Stallman from google video. I'd like my 22C3 lightning talk from 04 on google video, it's with this stupid mac codec. Might get into that some day.

sh: If you come, I can guarantee you that we can make any gobby, teamspeak, etc. work in the lecture rooms, so no technical difficulties. There will be a lot of polish linux developers giving speeches too.

ma: It's just around the corner from Berlin. Gobby is megastable on your server. Congrats. Makes me feel much better about ting

sh: It behaved weird when I tried to make the goban on it.

ma: The Go board. Searching to get it into graphics is good. The gobby-painter. Rembrandobby.

sh: You don't really need grpahics to play go :)

   A B C D E F G H J K L M N O P Q R S T
19 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 19
18 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 18
17 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 17
16 . . . + . . . . . + . . . . . + . . . 16
15 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 15
14 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 14
13 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 13
12 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 12
11 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 11
10 . . . + . . . . . + . . . . . + . . . 10
 9 . . . . . . O O . . . . . . . . . . .  9
 8 . . . . O X O . . . . . . . . . . . .  8
 7 . . . X X X . . . . . . . . . . . . .  7
 6 . . X O . O . . . . . . . . . . . . .  6
 5 . . . . . O . . . . . . . . . . . . .  5
 4 . . . X . X . . . + . . . . . + . . .  4
 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .  3
 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .  2
 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .  1
   A B C D E F G H J K L M N O P Q R S T

No, no, that's just a board, the '+' are just to mark some places. You play putting Xs and Os.

ma: k, good you can't see the others cursor in gobby. In moonedit you can. Visible cursors are better, I think.

sh: Yes, it's good to see where was the last move. But go is a pretty neat game, for such playing, as you rarely take the pieces off of the board.

brb, gotta load the washing machine re, I'm sorry

ma: Oh, load the washing machine. Lord, oh load it. I'm playing Go while I rather should work on http://hivwiki.org. Not that easy to start such.

sh: need any help on hive-wiki?

ma: The one for making a multi-engine-hive? Yes. Started a hive- and a hiv-wiki.

sh: What's a hive? Something like oddwiki, allowing you to set up new wiki easily?

ma: make a wiki instantly without having to answer any questions, that is a wiki-hive. The others are -farms. I sometimes call -farms -hives as I whish they were -hives.

sh: But if it's a multi-engine hive, then you must at least answer to the question about what engine you prefer ;)

ma: Got me. ;) Let's say stupid, eviteable ones. Mabe it should rightaway create it on all engines and you just use what you like. :) To evite questions, know? If you want to save 150 KB on the server you can cross out Mediawiki during creation if you're sure you want it on moin-moin ;) Does an empty wiki weigh 150 KB? Not that much that it mattered, I guess.

sh: Where do you want to get the server for this? It's disk space and bandwidth, it costs.

ma: I know. It's an idea. And I liked the stamp. Best from the community. Donations, voluntary taxes to keep the thing running.

sh: Going educational/scientific would probably work, but universities and schools would probably want some restrictions and control -- no commercial use, for example. I know my university would.

ma: no commercial use, yes. If you get the money somwhere you do not need it if there are no people eager for money in the decising positions. Guess a wiki-community could understand that and everybody gives 10 dollars every two years. In the average, if the community's big enough that would pay the expenses. Getting it even cheaper when collaborating with other communities.

sh: The problem is that you need a stable budget, or a person that'd take the responsibility if suddenly the money are not enough to cover the costs.

ma: I'm thinking about making a reduced version of the GotoBar and the SideBar on my wiki, cutting out the wiki-net related links. That would be much easier for beginners. I wonder what woud be a good way. It's like your themes on the oddwiki-zen-garden. Choosing with or without wiki-net related links. The simple without version would be just the same wiki, only the bars are less clustered

sh: You can disable the gotobar in the config, but it's oddwiki, so it's not that... Do you have an url? Those links are probably near links, and they are classed, so we could probably remove the near links from gotobar with style.

ma: I'm thinking about most of my wikis on oddwiki. Take http://www.communitywiki.org/odd/HivWiki/FrontPage for example which is the most recent. Wiki-net yes, but for newbies first without it.

sh: nope, those are normal links :/ where do you define them?

ma: on the GotoBar and on the SideBar, true?

sh: weird, the url abbreviations don't work :/ Look at your home wiki. Is this what you mean? The links will be there if you only change the style. But this has a drawback in oddwiki -- the cookie is shared, so if you change the style for one wiki, you will have it on all the wikis.


found out why the abbreviations were not working. I edited NearMap instead of InterMap. Fixed it now.

Ok, so there are three changes:

1. Added NearLinks url abbreviation, with the same URL as Self
2. Edited the GotoBar to use that abbreviation
3. Added a rule to css that hides all links using that abbreviation in the

Why there are two calendars on your page?

ma: one is for talk one is for events on hiv-wiki, on mine it's talk and my personal agenda, I don't propperly use it.

sh: they should be labelled, or something

ma: yes, I didn't get that far. There is talk, agenda, events, tings in the second calendar on different wikis. Another ugent thing is to displace the key, icon with a looking-glass icon. It looks as if you first have to unlock the wiki. I didn't realize this for months.

sh: isn't it supposed to be a 'go' button?

ma: It's the search, looking-glass, init?

hmm, maybe there should be wiki-net on/off in the sidebar? When you click it it toggles between the simple and the "wiki-net links included on the surface"- version. That would be cool. It might even make sense to create three different degrees of complexity. Am I on the wrong track? I'm not sure.

ma: I have a new color. Looking into Wikalong. Like peekko, a wiki on every web-site. I wonder if such is imaginable also with collab-editor and with VoIP?


ma: Seems we have some kind of public perma-ting running now. Good. You can work in real-time, others can see on an ordinary web-page what is going on, quasi in real-time by simply reloading the page. This is terrific! Tings as appointements for gathering in a room of tools that exists 24/7. Like a band jam-session cellar with an open door, instruments and amps provided and live on the air around the clock. You turn your radio on, hear that two guys are jamming and teletransport in to play along for a while. I like that.

See also the ting inclusion in a web-page TheSheep made for gobby, yeah!