Windows Vista Antivir Double Edged Sword

02:37 <+jnk> MS is hardening things because everyone complained, and now businesses complain that they're hardening things

02:37 <@Jet> they use the APIs to integrate AV scanning into file loading

02:38 <@Jet> Symantec and Adobe saw that teh EU would be open to listening to their whining

02:38 < Gaheris`> I want the antivirus industry to GO AWAY

02:38 <@Jet> because the EU hates MS

02:39 <@Jet> so they are using the opportunity to protect their business at the expense of the customer

02:39 <@Jet> but MS is the bad guy.

02:39 <+jnk> symantec can't integrate closely as they need and they argue that MS is forcing their own security model into windows by including their security center, virus scan, firewall, etc and restricting the ability for others to replace that

02:39 <+jnk> I'm not saying MS is the bad guy

02:39 < Gaheris`> they aren't RESTRICTING SHIT

02:40 <+jnk> MS is doing the same as any other business in trying to protect their interests

02:40 < Gaheris`> There is nothing stopping Symantec from providing AV support to Vista.

02:40 <@Jet> http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/device/network/WFP.mspx WFP is a new architecture in Windows Vista that allows unprecedented access to the TCP/IP packet processing path, wherein outgoing and incoming packets can be examined or changed before allowing them to be processed further. By tapping into the TCP/IP processing path, ISVs can create firewalls, antivirus software, diagnostic software, and other types of applications and services.

02:40 <@Jet> UNPRECENDENT ACCESS TO THE TCP/IP PACKET PROCESSING PATH

02:41 <@Jet> all without hacking winsock.dll

02:41 <@Jet> imagine that

02:41 < Gaheris`> yeah, that's GOOD

02:41 <@Jet> but Symantec programmers obviously can't figure it out

02:41 < Gaheris`> Meanwhile, after the last 6 years of spyware and malware, the antivirus vendors have no fucking room to talk about ANYTHING

02:42 < Gaheris`> they can suck my dick

02:52 < Gaheris`> but anyway, as far as the AV vendors and the Vista Kernel are concerned -- basically what the AV vendors are saying is "Microsoft shouldn't be allowed to close a security hole in their operating system, because our software uses those security holes in order to prevent other software that uses those same security holes from getting on the machine"

02:52 < Gaheris`> Symantec wants to encourage an insecure operating system

02:52 < Gaheris`> Because their entire existence is based on it

02:52 < Gaheris`> they DON'T WANT Windows to be secure

02:52 <+jnk> that's what I meant by double edged sword